Monday, December 22, 2008

Jim Rogers On Where to Invest

Don't buy American until Dow drops below 4000.

Read it here.

11 comments:

Douglas Porter said...

I.E. wages drop to 4000 level prices. What a selfish prick.

Josh said...

If the government would stop price fixing, prices would fall with wages. However, there will be massive unemployment and the government will continue propping up prices, making the lower wages even more damaging.

Douglas Porter said...

"If the government would stop price fixing, prices would fall with wages. However, there will be massive unemployment and the government will continue propping up prices, making the lower wages even more damaging."

Sorry, how is the government "price fixing"?

Josh said...

Subsidizing the auto industry is keeping the price of their cars and labor up when the market is demanding it to be down.

The FED artificially sets the price of credit when the market should be.

Through buying up bad mortgages, they are keeping the prices of houses up.

Every time they intervene, they are price fixing.

Douglas Porter said...

"Subsidizing the auto industry is keeping the price of their cars and labor up when the market is demanding it to be down."

Hey, jackass, the free market is systematicaly eliminating high paying jobs, turning people into three dollar an hour slaves. THAT is the market.

"The FED artificially sets the price of credit when the market should be."

The FED is a result of your immoral position. Democratic ACTION is needed to keep democracies/republics healthy. If a greater part of the population just wants to sit on their asses complaining about this and that corruption, then it is their own bloody faults when everything goes to shit. IT IS YOUR FAULT FOR NOT ACTING. The founders of the constitution knew this. That's why they thought the people had the right to revolt. What are libertarians doing? Complaining in their armchairs.

"Through buying up bad mortgages, they are keeping the prices of houses up."

They think they can restore confidence if they do this. If they restore confidence, then people will start buying again. If everyone starts buying again, then those who lost their jobs will be hired again. Once this happens, any debt that was incured from the crisis can be paid back with real dollars.

"Every time they intervene, they are price fixing."

Price fixing! Oh god no! People don't want to be slave laborers! OH NO!

Josh said...

"Hey, jackass, the free market is systematicaly eliminating high paying jobs, turning people into three dollar an hour slaves. THAT is the market."

Again with the name calling.

"The FED is a result of your immoral position."

How so?

"If a greater part of the population just wants to sit on their asses complaining about this and that corruption, then it is their own bloody faults when everything goes to shit. IT IS YOUR FAULT FOR NOT ACTING. The founders of the constitution knew this. That's why they thought the people had the right to revolt. What are libertarians doing? Complaining in their armchairs."

I don't disagree, but you'd be foolish to think there aren't people in the southern US arming up. Gun sales have been booming. I think if an economic collapse occurs, you'll see people in Texas revolt first, if there is any such action taken.

"They think they can restore confidence if they do this. If they restore confidence, then people will start buying again. If everyone starts buying again, then those who lost their jobs will be hired again. Once this happens, any debt that was incured from the crisis can be paid back with real dollars."

FDR tried to instill confidence for 10 years, it never happened. Instead he let the Japanese bomb Pearl Harbour and sent the country into a war. Noone is going to start buying again at those prices because they don't have the money. US has lost 2 million jobs in 1 year and others are being replaced with lower paying jobs, and a lot of these will be wiped out once a chunk of retail goes bankrupt in the next few months.

"Price fixing! Oh god no! People don't want to be slave laborers! OH NO!"

I don't see the relation. But price fixing doesn't help anything. Prices need to deflate because there will be high unemployment and lower paying jobs. Prices need to come down too or else individuals are going to get hit with a DOUBLE WHAMMY.

Douglas Porter said...

"Again with the name calling."

When someone blatantly ignores the facts, they DESERVE to be called names for being DISHONEST.

"How so?"

Let the capitalists do what ever they want by abandoning left wing politics. Surprise, surprise. The corrupt part of the capitalist class has decided to capitalize on the government. Surprise, surprise.

"I don't disagree, but you'd be foolish to think there aren't people in the southern US arming up. Gun sales have been booming. I think if an economic collapse occurs, you'll see people in Texas revolt first, if there is any such action taken."

States breaking up is not going to solve the problem. That's why your ideology is even more moronic. You have bedded with those who don't really believe in the principles of the constitution when they contradict their religious views and business interests.

"FDR tried to instill confidence for 10 years, it never happened. Instead he let the Japanese bomb Pearl Harbour and sent the country into a war. Noone is going to start buying again at those prices because they don't have the money. US has lost 2 million jobs in 1 year and others are being replaced with lower paying jobs, and a lot of these will be wiped out once a chunk of retail goes bankrupt in the next few months."

Wow, your ideology has made such a beautiful world! Corrupt government, a movement toward low-paying jobs, a return to poverty after 60 years of affluence.

"
I don't see the relation. But price fixing doesn't help anything. Prices need to deflate because there will be high unemployment and lower paying jobs. Prices need to come down too or else individuals are going to get hit with a DOUBLE WHAMMY."

How about this, Josh? How about we stop supporting the politics of the capitalist class? Why don't we bar domestic corporations from selling at home if they don't provide jobs at home? Why don't we allow the Chinese to create Chinese industry? The problem here is not that there is no solution, but that the propaganda machine continues to take a shit.

Josh said...

"When someone blatantly ignores the facts, they DESERVE to be called names for being DISHONEST."

Deserve? Lol, alrighty.

"The corrupt part of the capitalist class has decided to capitalize on the government. Surprise, surprise."

Indeed. . .

"That's why your ideology is even more moronic. You have bedded with those who don't really believe in the principles of the constitution when they contradict their religious views and business interests."

More insults. You could just say, "that is the fallacy of your ideology". Could we try to keep this civil? Now please explain how I'm in bed with those who ignore the consitution when it contradicts their religious views and business interests. And also, if breaking up the states mean that the people of each section gets a government of the people, than it does help. It helped when the USSR broke up.

"Wow, your ideology has made such a beautiful world! Corrupt government, a movement toward low-paying jobs, a return to poverty after 60 years of affluence."

I'm not sure what my ideology has to do with this. The FED has been in place since 1913. . .not really in line with my ideology. Remember, Clinton was on the board of directors for WalMart, the left's hero until Obama came around.

"How about this, Josh? How about we stop supporting the politics of the capitalist class? Why don't we bar domestic corporations from selling at home if they don't provide jobs at home? Why don't we allow the Chinese to create Chinese industry? The problem here is not that there is no solution, but that the propaganda machine continues to take a shit."

In general I'm not a fan of protectionism. If the US dollar was backed by gold and if private property was properly protected, this wouldn't be an issue. The price of oil would be far too high for shipping products from China. This is not something I want to argue much though because I can't confidently make the connection yet. It is a problem, but at the turn of the century, with the largest and wealthiest middle class in the world, the US was taking his hundreds of thousands of immigrants to support their growing economy. The largest difference between than and now would've been the difficulty of manufacturing in China and then shipping to the west, as well as the gold backed dollar.

Douglas Porter said...

"Deserve? Lol, alrighty."

Yup. You can't just go along with your fingers in your ears, your eyes closed, but your mouth uncorked.

"More insults. You could just say, "that is the fallacy of your ideology". Could we try to keep this civil?"

Dishonesty is uncivil. You started it.

"Now please explain how I'm in bed with those who ignore the consitution when it contradicts their religious views and business interests."

Your leader is part of the Republican party. Your leaders allow their principles to be used by the Republican party to moderate the leftwing/liberals.

"And also, if breaking up the states mean that the people of each section gets a government of the people, than it does help. It helped when the USSR broke up."

Smaller government is not better government, Josh. This is one of those repetitions that is making me angry. Just because you have a smaller government does not give its ruling majority any more legitimacy. There is still a minority who disagrees. There are still statist institutions with authority. And there are still government agencies based on taxes.

Josh said...

"Yup. You can't just go along with your fingers in your ears, your eyes closed, but your mouth uncorked."

I certainly do none of the three.

"Dishonesty is uncivil. You started it."

You can lie in a civil manner, although I'm not sure I've lied. I'd like you point it out if I have lied.

"Your leader is part of the Republican party. Your leaders allow their principles to be used by the Republican party to moderate the leftwing/liberals."

You're blaming moderate left wing liberal politics on Peter Schiff, Jim Rogers, Ron Paul and Lew Rockwell? And you're asserting they're doing this in collusion with the Republican Party? Wow, quite the conspiracy theory.

Also, you didn't explain how "I'm in bed with those who ignore the consitution when it contradicts their religious views and business interests." In fact, you never mentioned the constitution once in your reply.

"Smaller government is not better government, Josh."

Yes it is.

"This is one of those repetitions that is making me angry."

So stop giving me opportunity to repeat it.

"Just because you have a smaller government does not give its ruling majority any more legitimacy."

It does give it more legitimacy, but also, the larger the minority that disagrees with it, the more the government needs to play to support these minority as their access to the government is greater at the local level.

"There is still a minority who disagrees. There are still statist institutions with authority."

There always will be, but if the local government doesn't behave in the manner the minority doesn't like, in a free nation, they can move to another locality.

"And there are still government agencies based on taxes."

Not necessarily an income tax though, and it could be based on tariffs or other fees.

Douglas Porter said...

"You're blaming moderate left wing liberal politics on Peter Schiff, Jim Rogers, Ron Paul and Lew Rockwell? And you're asserting they're doing this in collusion with the Republican Party? Wow, quite the conspiracy theory."

That, or political strategy.

"Yes it is."

No, it isn't.

"Also, you didn't explain how "I'm in bed with those who ignore the consitution when it contradicts their religious views and business interests." In fact, you never mentioned the constitution once in your reply."

Freedom of Choice.

"So stop giving me opportunity to repeat it."

Stop lying to yourself.

"It does give it more legitimacy, but also, the larger the minority that disagrees with it, the more the government needs to play to support these minority as their access to the government is greater at the local level."

It is no different at the federal level.

"There always will be, but if the local government doesn't behave in the manner the minority doesn't like, in a free nation, they can move to another locality."

Pish-posh.

"Not necessarily an income tax though, and it could be based on tariffs or other fees."

I see no reason to believe that couldn't develop the same way.